Madonna - Look What You Made Me Do

[dylanlioncourt 5,780]

The thing is the press can try to paint Madonna as this cold witch who trashes Gaga but people forget Madonna gave Gaga a lot of support even before BTW, going to her shows, saying she liked her music and style and she was very much like a younger Madonna.

Then the whole BTW/EY happened and it was people who found the similarities and I remember the song dropped around 3-4AM and people on Twitter trended Express Yourself. Gaga went on TV and thanked Whitney and then later said she had Madonna's blessing which Liz I believe denied ever getting that e-mail then the onslaught from Gaga's team happened where she was getting bashed relentlessly while Madonna remained mum on the topic until she was ASKED in 2012.

Even now, when does Madonna mention Gaga except during the panel with Marilyn Minter? Gaga's the one still speaking about how unsupportive Madonna is and cold she was and using her to sell her documentary? I'm sorry Gaga should have owned the inspiration and said "Hell yeah, I am a huge M fan so of course it's intentional" but acting like she's a better musician and claiming Madonna doesn't write, produce or have a hand in her own music. Please. 

[Guest]

And Madonna has said nothing negative about Gaga in public.  Of course, some took her "reductive" comment out of context and tried to make like that was a diss at Gaga when it was actually in reference to Madonna's thoughts on the whole idea the song sounds similar. Of course, Madonna hears it.  But she also recognizes that there are a lot of artists including herself who may subconsciously if not innocently write music that might sound like other songs.  After all, I hear a lot of songs out there today that remind of a lot of Beatles songs if not sound similar,  but it doesn't mean those artists were intentionally trying to copy or steal from them.

[Fighter 28,798]

@@thelioncourtheart_

 

 

 

TBH I don't hate Gaga and I understand if she wanted to piss M off,and I also like a lot of her music but I wish she would just move on not only about this but other negative things like the notion of people leaving her. She's got so much in her life including a successful career, talent, a loving family, and she cant let go of things like that since years ago... 

[gafuller 1,653]

Lady Gaga's discography just hasn't matured yet, and still kill the charts, like Madonna did. But they're two different artists, to be fair. Lady Gaga became a hit in a generation (mine) that has a much smaller attention span, and easily fettered loyalty. Madonna's first fans are some of the strongest fans, very loyal and devoted, even when they don't quite care or like her sound. Joanne was... Eh. It was like she tried reinventing herself in a country, back to the roots kind of sound and image and it just doesn't sound all that great.

[PlayPause 2,684]

 

She's not so mature lately, remember?:

-Bitch I'm Madonna video (ultra teenager and where artists record cameos away from different cities, she tried to do something like Taylor's Bad Blood)

-The Drake performance

-The Bitch I'm Madonna performance at Jimmy

-Her last runway in Met

 

 

As if Taylor invented the all-star video.

(There is at least one celebrity from the late 80s in each shot of this video, check the full version)

 

I wrote "emotionally mature person" seeing how she reacts to criticism and all the shit she's been getting for 30+ years. I never said she was boring and predictable as an artist.

[Guest]

Lady Gaga's discography just hasn't matured yet, and still kill the charts, like Madonna did. But they're two different artists, to be fair. Lady Gaga became a hit in a generation (mine) that has a much smaller attention span, and easily fettered loyalty. Madonna's first fans are some of the strongest fans, very loyal and devoted, even when they don't quite care or like her sound. Joanne was... Eh. It was like she tried reinventing herself in a country, back to the roots kind of sound and image and it just doesn't sound all that great.

I'm one of those longstanding fans of Madonna.  And I also like to add that when I became a Madonna fan, we weren't able to instantly call up a song, album or video that was just released. We had to wait.  We also didn't spend hours on hours discussing ridiculous and small technical details of her work.  While I agree we all have our opinions of what we like better, etc, but it really wasn't until the internet age (and more quite lately than earlier on) that I ran into discussions dissecting every small detail that in most cases have no relevance oh how great the music is or an entertainer she is.  Also, an album cover and/or VHS cover wasn't something we really thought to get worked up over nor thought to pass on purchasing over.  The same goes for a setlist or what was included or not included, even though when we saw it in concert it included more.  All in all, we just enjoyed what was released without dissecting it to death. 

 

Different times, I guess!! 

[G House 1,952]

@@thelioncourtheart_

 

 

 

TBH I don't hate Gaga and I understand if she wanted to piss M off,and I also like a lot of her music but I wish she would just move on not only about this but other negative things like the notion of people leaving her. She's got so much in her life including a successful career, talent, a loving family, and she cant let go of things like that since years ago... 

 

Yeah, it really bothers me when she says that fans betray or abandon her when she doesn't release what we want, as if we weren't "true fans" for not licking her ass 24/7. We don't have to be always happy with what she does, that's critical thinking.

 

I consider myself a fan of her work and in some aspects a fan of her, but not a little monster.

[Fighter 28,798]

Yeah, it really bothers me when she says that fans betray or abandon her when she doesn't release what we want, as if we weren't "true fans" for not licking her ass 24/7. We don't have to be always happy with what she does, that's critical thinking.

 

I consider myself a fan of her work and in some aspects a fan of her, but not a little monster.

 

And Madonna calls us fascists and whiny bitches lmao

[Guest]

And Madonna calls us fascists and whiny bitches lmao

Let's be fair now... this is due to people demanding things from her.  I totally understand the genuine disappointment from fans, but some fans have taken it too far by making demands on her that are just ridiculous.  In fact, the "Fascists" reference is being taken out of context.  If I recall correctly, she wasn't necessarily calling all fans "fascists" but simply noting she doesn't succumb to "fascist" demands.

[Fighter 28,798]

Let's be fair now... this is due to people demanding things from her.  I totally understand the genuine disappointment from fans, but some fans have taken it too far by making demands on her that are just ridiculous.  In fact, the "Fascists" reference is being taken out of context.  If I recall correctly, she wasn't necessarily calling all fans "fascists" but simply noting she doesn't succumb to "fascist" demands.

 

She may have been using some form of irony that was a bit lost in translation. Instagram just isn't the best way for expression through text...

 

Anyway I'd rather have her being honest to fans than victimizing herself. I definitely think some fans take things way too far but that's how fandoms are tbh.

[Guest]

She may have been using some form of irony that was a bit lost in translation. Instagram just isn't the best way for expression through text...

 

Anyway I'd rather have her being honest to fans than victimizing herself. I definitely think some fans take things way too far but that's how fandoms are tbh.

I've never came away thinking she "victimizes herself".  I've always thought if anything she was defending herself.  I think people tend to forget she's human too and has feelings.  Like anyone of us who feels they are being attacked, we are going to bite back. And yeah, even Madonna may overreact at times. I don't begrudge her for that. I remember a time not too long ago that we rarely got a glimpse of her personal life, nor bits and peaces of things she's working on, in progress.  The closest we got is hearing on MTV or in a magazine she is working on a project (whether it's a movie or album) and it would be months or a year later before we would hear anymore about it.  I look back at that time with fondness, but I don't think I'd want her to keep things all bottled up and hear nothing from her.

[Fighter 28,798]

I've never came away thinking she "victimizes herself".  I've always thought if anything she was defending herself.  I think people tend to forget she's human too and has feelings.  Like anyone of us who feels they are being attacked, we are going to bite back. And yeah, even Madonna may overreact at times. I don't begrudge her for that. I remember a time not too long ago that we rarely got a glimpse of her personal life, nor bits and peaces of things she's working on, in progress.  The closest we got is hearing on MTV or in a magazine she is working on a project (whether it's a movie or album) and it would be months or a year later before we would hear anymore about it.  I look back at that time with fondness, but I don't think I'd want her to keep things all bottled up and hear nothing from her.

 

well Id be ok with her not giving too many details in advance for a project, just because it builds too crazy expectations that you can't fulfill no matter what, but yes I love that there's so much more connection now.

 

BTW I meant in comparison to Gaga who someone said sort of victimizes herself with her fans, not sure if it's true but yeah Id rather have M overreacting than doing that. i feel like it's more even, since Madonna fans can be the biggest bitches. 

[Guest]

Madonna's always been blunt and honest about things, even about fans.  I remember she did an interview back in the 80's, (I think the Jane Pauley interview?) where she admitted being a bit annoyed by the fans hanging outside her home. If I recall correctly, she said something of the sort the fans would hang out as if they thought they would "be invited up for tea and cookies".  She also has always denied autographs especially when she's out and about.  That all said, I don't believe she dislike her fans. I think she just has a love-hate relationship with us.  I also think within the last few years, she's been more open to sharing her life with fans, compared to before. 

 

As for the "expectations" fans have regarding her projects that she might tease us about, that's pretty much on the fans.  I love how she shares a bit of the process with us now.  It's I just don't take everything she states so literally and know that sometimes when she says things it's not always set in stone.  For instance, "a bigger project".  I have no doubt there was some intention for such a project, regarding the Rebel Heart Tour.  Just like back in the 90's, she mentioned doing a Remix album called "Veronica Electronica".  Sometimes, things just don't pan out as she expects.  But some fans seem to hold everything against her if she doesn't come through with ideas she might be thinking about doing. 

[dylanlioncourt 5,780]

How did a thread about Gaga/Madonna turn into criticizing fans?   
Every fanbase has their rabid, overly critical fans and some that are more calm and reasonable. 

As for Gaga, I don't buy any of her "victimization." She's practically come out and says she suffers from every ailment under the sun and this documentary reeks of using Madonna's name to gain viewers who want the dirt.

To bring the topic but on subject, Madonna was smart not to respond in a way female rappers do but putting out disses and making albums towards a "feud." What she did was pure Madonna moment and a "if the shoe fits, wear it" so it was a reality check for Gaga that by following Madonna's career closely eventually she'd be called out. Of course, people who are inspired and big fans don't imply that their idols are not as dedicated to their crafts as they are. She didn't last three decades having a label or men in suits dictating her artistic journey.

I have no sympathy for this.

Plays the victim while giving her a back-handed compliment and what has been stated by people who saw it paint her as a woman who doesn't support other artists and doesn't have the guts to confront people. She did help other people with Maverick, several charities and a lot of things under the radar but oh well. 

[Maddyone 98]

Madonna already did her Look What You Made Me Do...it's called Human Nature

[Fighter 28,798]

There are people who put Madonna in a pedestal so high that they can't help but feel resentment towards her for being disappointing in some ways, and not embodying the ideal that they project on her. I think Courtney Love was one of those people, Camille Paglia probably as well, and I think Gaga is amongst those people. It's a twisted form of admiration. I think a lot of fans have felt that way one time or another so I get it. I don't really think there's much Madonna can do because it's not really about the real person but about an idea.
 

[Madgesty 2,743]

Just want to mention her demo for Rebel Heart "Two Steps Behind Me".

[G House 1,952]

Madonna already did her Look What You Made Me Do...it's called Human Nature

 

[kesiak 3,036]

I'm one of those longstanding fans of Madonna.  And I also like to add that when I became a Madonna fan, we weren't able to instantly call up a song, album or video that was just released. We had to wait.  We also didn't spend hours on hours discussing ridiculous and small technical details of her work.  While I agree we all have our opinions of what we like better, etc, but it really wasn't until the internet age (and more quite lately than earlier on) that I ran into discussions dissecting every small detail that in most cases have no relevance oh how great the music is or an entertainer she is.  Also, an album cover and/or VHS cover wasn't something we really thought to get worked up over nor thought to pass on purchasing over.  The same goes for a setlist or what was included or not included, even though when we saw it in concert it included more.  All in all, we just enjoyed what was released without dissecting it to death. 

 

Different times, I guess!! 

 

I'm so with you on that and I'm constantly perplexed by this.

[PlayPause 2,684]

Just want to mention her demo for Rebel Heart "Two Steps Behind Me".

 

She never put it out officially and never discussed its meaning.

A demo is a demo aka work in progress.

Had the song been on the final RH tracklist, the lyrics might have been very different.

[Guest]

How did a thread about Gaga/Madonna turn into criticizing fans?   

 

Actually, the thread wasn't about Madonna versus Gaga.  It was about suggesting that Madonna do something of the sort like Taylor's done with her new song/video.  But of course, some people (including Gaga) cannot let the one sided feud go.  The only people get worked up about this are some fans on both sides and Lady Gaga. 

[devilpray 2,387]

I want to stab myself in the eye while reading this mess

[BringUrLUV 1,108]

She also did acknowledge once that the verse melody on Rihanna's "Please Don't Stop The Music" sounded familiar (cf. Who's That Girl), but she didn't sue either or mention it ever after.

 

I don't hear any similarities between these two songs at all.  What am I missing?

[Fighter 28,798]

I want to stab myself in the eye while reading this mess

 

this thread is a mess cos the premise was a mess tbh

[Madame Madonna 4,107]

Look what Madonna made Lady gaga's career.

Madonna define Lady gaga's whole career with just A single word.

 

Reductive.

 

That's why I love Madonna so much. She is Genius.